but have you guys ever thought about going into the Rock 'n' Roll business?
I've already got my coat on.
So how did the meet go?
by dirtydids » 28 Nov 2006, 12:57
Sorry Leon, I think you are wrong on this one.
Bill originally asked how the meetup went and admittedly put a "Tongue in Cheek" comment regards attire, take it as he probably meant it, a joke.
I feel the main item is about the problem of new people attending who failed to meet the members of the group through identification breakdown.
Mercedes did not place any criticism on this thread, she just replied to a comment from Hayley, and i cant again see her comment as criticism.
This is all getting back to what happened at the summer meet when Mercedes wore a pvc dress with a daring back and front line and which a person present appeared to deem unsuitable afterwards. It has been fully explained elsewhere that this is Mercedes "Normal" wear for clubbing and going out in, she is only 23 and she is into these clothes as a norm.She attended that night dressed how she would to go out, and not how a lot of girls do just for the shootsfor effect.
This is all history and neither myself nor Mercedes hold grudges and i also spoke for over 2 hours on the telephone to one of the original organisers several months ago regarding all this and have on my computer a pm from this person giving it the ok for Mercedes to attend any other future meet wearing pvc albiet not quite so revealing with which she was happy about.
At this last meet there has been according to posts on this and UMD forum at least 5 people who went to London but failed to make contact with the group. namely: Chantelle,Mercedes,(who both wore the same, Leather jackets, jeans and thighboots) hardly fetish wear.Stonecastle, Essex_Sandra and Dazuk.
Hayley and Bill in my opinion were merely pointing this out and in a good humoured way were making suggestions, not criticism.
There obviosly is a problem as this is not the first time this has happened either as already stated on threads from previous meetings.
I think Hayleys suggestion of the place in Charing Cross is worth looking into, it would be private so no chance of any member of public overhearing any conversation, and it is very convenient for travel arrangements wherever in the country you may be coming from as well.
I do however still feel upset that you have posted in this way, you yourself were present at the meet when this all blew up, and we spoke, you didnt give any indication you might personally be embarrassed if at all.
At the end of the day i think it is great that there are now producers such as yourself and Bill (hopefully one day Hayley) and i suppose myself albiet i dont look at myself as such, i do it for fun and because we want to, Noise etc attending these meets, as well as bringing some of the girls as well. It gives people who would otherwise only see pics the chance to meet the people involved and give feedback, ideas, etc we should not be infighting amongst ourselves.
It may be that you yourself has caused embarressment to members of the public without even realising it when you have turned up in very public places with some of your girls and done one of your shoots, personally i think you are brilliant as it does take some guts with all concerned to do this.
Due to the accident i had in August i was unable to attend the past 2 meets which did upset me, if we had been able to come Cede would have worn pvc and one of the organisers knew what is was going to be and had no problems with it.
Leon, in the nicest possible way please dont criticise unless you know all the facts which i dont believe you did here, and try not to read into what i feel as lighthearted jokes as criticism as i am sure neither Bill nor Hayley would lower themselves to that level.
dirtdids
Bill originally asked how the meetup went and admittedly put a "Tongue in Cheek" comment regards attire, take it as he probably meant it, a joke.
I feel the main item is about the problem of new people attending who failed to meet the members of the group through identification breakdown.
Mercedes did not place any criticism on this thread, she just replied to a comment from Hayley, and i cant again see her comment as criticism.
This is all getting back to what happened at the summer meet when Mercedes wore a pvc dress with a daring back and front line and which a person present appeared to deem unsuitable afterwards. It has been fully explained elsewhere that this is Mercedes "Normal" wear for clubbing and going out in, she is only 23 and she is into these clothes as a norm.She attended that night dressed how she would to go out, and not how a lot of girls do just for the shootsfor effect.
This is all history and neither myself nor Mercedes hold grudges and i also spoke for over 2 hours on the telephone to one of the original organisers several months ago regarding all this and have on my computer a pm from this person giving it the ok for Mercedes to attend any other future meet wearing pvc albiet not quite so revealing with which she was happy about.
At this last meet there has been according to posts on this and UMD forum at least 5 people who went to London but failed to make contact with the group. namely: Chantelle,Mercedes,(who both wore the same, Leather jackets, jeans and thighboots) hardly fetish wear.Stonecastle, Essex_Sandra and Dazuk.
Hayley and Bill in my opinion were merely pointing this out and in a good humoured way were making suggestions, not criticism.
There obviosly is a problem as this is not the first time this has happened either as already stated on threads from previous meetings.
I think Hayleys suggestion of the place in Charing Cross is worth looking into, it would be private so no chance of any member of public overhearing any conversation, and it is very convenient for travel arrangements wherever in the country you may be coming from as well.
I do however still feel upset that you have posted in this way, you yourself were present at the meet when this all blew up, and we spoke, you didnt give any indication you might personally be embarrassed if at all.
At the end of the day i think it is great that there are now producers such as yourself and Bill (hopefully one day Hayley) and i suppose myself albiet i dont look at myself as such, i do it for fun and because we want to, Noise etc attending these meets, as well as bringing some of the girls as well. It gives people who would otherwise only see pics the chance to meet the people involved and give feedback, ideas, etc we should not be infighting amongst ourselves.
It may be that you yourself has caused embarressment to members of the public without even realising it when you have turned up in very public places with some of your girls and done one of your shoots, personally i think you are brilliant as it does take some guts with all concerned to do this.
Due to the accident i had in August i was unable to attend the past 2 meets which did upset me, if we had been able to come Cede would have worn pvc and one of the organisers knew what is was going to be and had no problems with it.
Leon, in the nicest possible way please dont criticise unless you know all the facts which i dont believe you did here, and try not to read into what i feel as lighthearted jokes as criticism as i am sure neither Bill nor Hayley would lower themselves to that level.
dirtdids
I love a messy girl
by leonmoomin » 28 Nov 2006, 16:47
I do however still feel upset that you have posted in this way, you yourself were present at the meet when this all blew up, and we spoke, you didnt give any indication you might personally be embarrassed if at all.
I wasn't!
That's why I didn't give any indication!
Believe me, if I was that easily embarrased I wouldn't do the things I do!
There is more than the PVC dress issue going on here! The easiest way to deal with the cross issues is to apply a fair accross the board "vanilla" dress code rule! It is not possible to apply this rule to one and not others!
It is sad that Mercedes was brought into this, but, I believe fairness is the point!
I am well aware of the history of this, I did see the long thread here, but was put off answering it when it was sent off on a tangent before the issue was resolved!
My opinion is also fair and I am not actually having a go at anyone here! If you want a meet outside the vanilla confines, organise one!
Putting myself in the position of the organiser, this thread is just picking! Bill started this thread with the intention of poking fun! It may have been intended as a joke, but, at who's expense? If this was the only time I had seen this sort of "joke" it would not be so bad, but this "joke" keeps appearing and appearing! Perhaps it was funny the first time, but now its just bitchy!
It may be that you yourself has caused embarressment to members of the public without even realising it when you have turned up in very public places with some of your girls and done one of your shoots, personally i think you are brilliant as it does take some guts with all concerned to do this.
Hmmm, I would like to know how we have given members of the public anything more than something of curiosty or amusement? Not really the same thing at all?
How I wish to expose myself in public is completely diferent to exposing a group in public!
I do also see the point of newbies not being able to find the fellow wamers in a busy pub, its a shame that Mercedes and Chantelle were unable to find or mix with the group, a litte odd as the group knows who they are and they know who the group are? They didn't say they were coming, also if you had the organisers phone number and I can only assume that both Mercedes and Chantelle have your number, with a couple of calls both parties could easily have been united??? Its also a little odd that after meeting some of the very recognisable people at the meets on a previous occasion that Mercedes was not able to find them this time?
The Charing Cross venue sounds like a perfect venue for you to arrange your non-vanila meets! So stop trying to change the current meets and do that!
Anyways, my personal gripe is not with Mercedes and her PVC dress, I really had no problem with that, as I'm sure neither did other people! These are vanilla meets for more than one reason! The problem with rules are that they have to be applied accross the board, otherwise some people will cry that they are being victimised!
I did PM you in the UMD a few months ago to try to prevent this seeming like a public debate between producers!
Perhaps you didn't get it as you never replied?
leonmoomin
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leonmoomin - Posts: 93 [ View ]
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by leonmoomin » 28 Nov 2006, 16:57
The Charing Cross venue sounds like a perfect venue for you to arrange your non-vanila meets! So stop trying to change the current meets and do that!
In fact, I will go even further on this point!
If you can find a sutable venue, I will help you to organise a non-vanilla meet! I am happy to bring the gunge tank or dunk tank!
I can't say fairer than that!
leonmoomin
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leonmoomin - Posts: 93 [ View ]
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- Location: Bristol UK
by Richard » 28 Nov 2006, 17:09
What on earth is all this verbage about? 
. I couldn't give a damn what people wear, whether in private or in public, in the street or in a pub. Admittedly the pub wasn't ideal but that's a risk you have to take and I don't think anyone present was put off coming to future meets just because of that. The only criticism that I can raise (and it's a very minor one!) is that the maps could have been a bit more visible. I regret also not being able to converse with the more distant people (i.e. more than a few feet away) owing to the noise, - sorry, 'music'; but I certainly intend to join the next meet, in better conditions, I hope.
Richard.
. I couldn't give a damn what people wear, whether in private or in public, in the street or in a pub. Admittedly the pub wasn't ideal but that's a risk you have to take and I don't think anyone present was put off coming to future meets just because of that. The only criticism that I can raise (and it's a very minor one!) is that the maps could have been a bit more visible. I regret also not being able to converse with the more distant people (i.e. more than a few feet away) owing to the noise, - sorry, 'music'; but I certainly intend to join the next meet, in better conditions, I hope.
Richard.
by stonecastle » 28 Nov 2006, 19:19
i would have posted a photo of myself on here so people could recognise me but I can't post photos on here for some reason. It is hard to recognise people from a written description, but maybe I should have worn a hat, that probably would have done the trick.
- stonecastle
- Posts: 375 [ View ]
- Joined: 13 Nov 2006, 21:31
by dirtydids » 28 Nov 2006, 19:30
PLEASE everybody, dont use this to start another flame war, its all history and things in question at the time were resolved as i clearly stated so forget it.
My point was solely based on my own personal opinion that both Bill and Hayley were not being critical but saying things jokingly.
Perhaps Leon has got a very good point and perhaps maybe the jokes side of things are getting old hat now, but lets face it we all bring things up whenever we are out or talking with friends, sometimes events that happened years in the past.
My main concern was what other people have said, they went and couldnt find the group. Chantelle has never ever been to any meetup before and doesnt know anybody,Mercedes has only been to one. Neither of them decided to go untill they had finished their shopping which was their main reason for being in London that day, Cede even had Andy's number given her, but silly moo left it at home.Neither of them wanted to wander around a strange pub laden with shopping bags.I think i am correct in saying the other people who failed to meet up were also first-timers, so there does appear to be a problem maybe, i believe also this happened at several other meets.
I wouldnt have been able to help as i am stuck up in Nottinghamshire
I would personally think that if it was arranged in a private meeting room why would there be any problems with any type of dress? Come as you would do your wam or whatever, by this i mean dress as Cede does, if you are a crossdresser etc only the group would see you, i would imagine there would be somewhere people could change if it was easier for them that way.
I would really like to think that at the end of the day everybody who attends is involved or has the wam fetish and thats what its all about, honestly, think about it, it is a fetish through and through, many people would, and probably do think we are mad, but how can we as fetishers discrimminate against another fetish equally enjoyed by a fellow wammer.
This may have sidetracked slightly but hopefully may lead to a little more discussion .
BUT I DO WANT THIS TO DEVELOPE INTO ANY MORE FLAMING, BLAMING OR CRITICISM. LETS BE CONSTRUCTIVE.
I agree with what Sotonude has said about Venue's they can be hard to find, I agree the numbers going now have outgrown the Original 3 Greyhounds and the pub used at the Summer meet was crowded.
This is going to be a problem in London especially in the heart of the West End and Soho and Theatre land on the doorstep, i would imagine it would be worse on a Saturday as well as people tend to go out more at weekends not having to work on the Sunday (by this i mean the Lucky ones ) A pub which might be quiet midweek when inspected for a meet might well seem suitable but on a Saturday "Yuck"
Lets concentrate on issues like this and recognition of each other thats far more important than squabbling.
I like Leons suggestion about Gunge Tanks but somehow a little something inside me tells me that i dont think it would be allowed however much wished for
dids
My point was solely based on my own personal opinion that both Bill and Hayley were not being critical but saying things jokingly.
Perhaps Leon has got a very good point and perhaps maybe the jokes side of things are getting old hat now, but lets face it we all bring things up whenever we are out or talking with friends, sometimes events that happened years in the past.
My main concern was what other people have said, they went and couldnt find the group. Chantelle has never ever been to any meetup before and doesnt know anybody,Mercedes has only been to one. Neither of them decided to go untill they had finished their shopping which was their main reason for being in London that day, Cede even had Andy's number given her, but silly moo left it at home.Neither of them wanted to wander around a strange pub laden with shopping bags.I think i am correct in saying the other people who failed to meet up were also first-timers, so there does appear to be a problem maybe, i believe also this happened at several other meets.
I wouldnt have been able to help as i am stuck up in Nottinghamshire
I would personally think that if it was arranged in a private meeting room why would there be any problems with any type of dress? Come as you would do your wam or whatever, by this i mean dress as Cede does, if you are a crossdresser etc only the group would see you, i would imagine there would be somewhere people could change if it was easier for them that way.
I would really like to think that at the end of the day everybody who attends is involved or has the wam fetish and thats what its all about, honestly, think about it, it is a fetish through and through, many people would, and probably do think we are mad, but how can we as fetishers discrimminate against another fetish equally enjoyed by a fellow wammer.
This may have sidetracked slightly but hopefully may lead to a little more discussion .
BUT I DO WANT THIS TO DEVELOPE INTO ANY MORE FLAMING, BLAMING OR CRITICISM. LETS BE CONSTRUCTIVE.
I agree with what Sotonude has said about Venue's they can be hard to find, I agree the numbers going now have outgrown the Original 3 Greyhounds and the pub used at the Summer meet was crowded.
This is going to be a problem in London especially in the heart of the West End and Soho and Theatre land on the doorstep, i would imagine it would be worse on a Saturday as well as people tend to go out more at weekends not having to work on the Sunday (by this i mean the Lucky ones
) A pub which might be quiet midweek when inspected for a meet might well seem suitable but on a Saturday "Yuck"
Lets concentrate on issues like this and recognition of each other thats far more important than squabbling.
I like Leons suggestion about Gunge Tanks but somehow a little something inside me tells me that i dont think it would be allowed however much wished for
dids
Last edited by dirtydids on 28 Nov 2006, 19:44, edited 2 times in total.
I love a messy girl
by Sploshman » 28 Nov 2006, 19:36
dirtydids wrote:This may have sidetracked slightly but hopefully may lead to a little more discussion .
BUT I DON'T WANT ANY MORE FLAMING, BLAMING OR CRITICISM. LETS BE CONSTRUCTIVE
I like Leons suggestion about Gunge Tanks but somehow a little something inside me tells me that i dont think it would be allowed however much wished for
dids
Well said and do agree Dids - let's put an end to this please!!!.
Would love to see the gungetank there as well (if possible lol).
by messylaura » 28 Nov 2006, 20:14
on a lighter note,
i found it amusing that the umd meet blended into the crowd so much that some people couldnt find them
maybe my idea of a little red flag wasn't such a daft idea after all
i found it amusing that the umd meet blended into the crowd so much that some people couldnt find them
maybe my idea of a little red flag wasn't such a daft idea after all
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messylaura - Posts: 548 [ View ]
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- Location: N.London (male)
by andy250 » 28 Nov 2006, 20:43
Hello all, thanks for the posts I will be offering my mobile no to all for the next meet, those who say they are going a week before the meet will be able to phone me about meeting up and what time etc.
Also if you are unsure or worried you will be able to contact myself.
This should then help the orgainsers do their job on the day ie hosting the event.
I spoke to one of the orgainsers this afternoon and they are happy for me to offer this.
Nice to see Leon joining who I met at the last meet in September, still driving the Seat. Mine decied not to start after three days in the garage!!!!
That car is an Arse!!!!
Anyway better go and think about how I can gunge Miss Helen in a couple of weeks.
regards
Andy
Also if you are unsure or worried you will be able to contact myself.
This should then help the orgainsers do their job on the day ie hosting the event.
I spoke to one of the orgainsers this afternoon and they are happy for me to offer this.
Nice to see Leon joining who I met at the last meet in September, still driving the Seat. Mine decied not to start after three days in the garage!!!!
That car is an Arse!!!!
Anyway better go and think about how I can gunge Miss Helen in a couple of weeks.
regards
Andy
by Smiley » 28 Nov 2006, 21:59
God where do i start lol. I did not expect this much response lol. Okay thanks for everyones comments, so many valid points made by all. Im just going to skim over a couple of things for the time being.
The most important issue first, missing people. Im going to sound like the bad guy here but i feel it has to be said. Sooo here it goes.....
Daz and Sandra did spot us, they were a little to shy to come over, which is understandable - i will not count this as a people who did not find us.
Stonecastle - Sorry you missed us but we did have around 3 maps on the table and an A-Z.
Chantelle and Mercedes, im sorry you missed us, i thought you might of spotted a regular or two but i can understand why you might not of done.
Let me explain my reasons for all of the above.
I think most of the above happened due to it being a Saturday night, this is the first time we have used this pub for the meet up - when a new venue is chosen there is an element of risk involved. Sadly this time around the pub was not to be, due to loud with music, dark lighting making harder to spot etc. Also there are alot of drinkers out on a Saturday meaning it's a harder job to try and find the right group - hence why we don't fancy another Saturday.
When Easy_As and i originally found this pub it was obviously not like this. We tried the pub, it did not work out as well as planned, so now we move on to look for another venue - which brings me very nicely to my next point,
Dids wrote
I would personally think that if it was arranged in a private meeting room why would there be any problems with any type of dress? Come as you would do your wam or whatever, by this i mean dress as Cede does, if you are a crossdresser etc only the group would see you, i would imagine there would be somewhere people could change if it was easier for them that way.
End
Perfect solution
i think this could work for all involved, Leon and the gunge tank, lots of rubber dresses and Bobby can come as Laura, people would not have to be worried about being overhead etc.
I would love to try this out - i think it would be a huge success, the trouble is finding a venue for this - so im hoping you lot out there can come up with a location for this so we can try it out..... Please get back if anyone can help and then we could make some ground here, Easy_as and i would obviously still like to keep the original meets going of course.
Finlay ( for now at least lol ) there is nothing wrong with an alternative to the original London meet - if anyone wants to try something out then go for it, we would be great full if anyone was thinking of trying something to give us a heads up on dates etc so we don't clash meets. I am more than happy to help others with advise and help in getting something else going but we don't really want to alter the style of the original London meet ups.
Also trusting we can all behave our selfs so this does not get locked.
Cheers
J
The most important issue first, missing people. Im going to sound like the bad guy here but i feel it has to be said. Sooo here it goes.....
Daz and Sandra did spot us, they were a little to shy to come over, which is understandable - i will not count this as a people who did not find us.
Stonecastle - Sorry you missed us but we did have around 3 maps on the table and an A-Z.
Chantelle and Mercedes, im sorry you missed us, i thought you might of spotted a regular or two but i can understand why you might not of done.
Let me explain my reasons for all of the above.
I think most of the above happened due to it being a Saturday night, this is the first time we have used this pub for the meet up - when a new venue is chosen there is an element of risk involved. Sadly this time around the pub was not to be, due to loud with music, dark lighting making harder to spot etc. Also there are alot of drinkers out on a Saturday meaning it's a harder job to try and find the right group - hence why we don't fancy another Saturday.
When Easy_As and i originally found this pub it was obviously not like this. We tried the pub, it did not work out as well as planned, so now we move on to look for another venue - which brings me very nicely to my next point,
Dids wrote
I would personally think that if it was arranged in a private meeting room why would there be any problems with any type of dress? Come as you would do your wam or whatever, by this i mean dress as Cede does, if you are a crossdresser etc only the group would see you, i would imagine there would be somewhere people could change if it was easier for them that way.
End
Perfect solution
i think this could work for all involved, Leon and the gunge tank, lots of rubber dresses and Bobby can come as Laura, people would not have to be worried about being overhead etc.
I would love to try this out - i think it would be a huge success, the trouble is finding a venue for this - so im hoping you lot out there can come up with a location for this so we can try it out..... Please get back if anyone can help and then we could make some ground here, Easy_as and i would obviously still like to keep the original meets going of course.
Finlay ( for now at least lol ) there is nothing wrong with an alternative to the original London meet - if anyone wants to try something out then go for it, we would be great full if anyone was thinking of trying something to give us a heads up on dates etc so we don't clash meets. I am more than happy to help others with advise and help in getting something else going but we don't really want to alter the style of the original London meet ups.
Also trusting we can all behave our selfs so this does not get locked.
Cheers
J
by DungeonMasterOne » 28 Nov 2006, 23:44
Lady Jasmine, Samson the gardener, and I were all planning to go to the Newcastle meet last year, fully in character and in costume (with Lady J in one of her georgous silk formal gowns), however it ended up clashing with Gotham 7 in London which killed the idea off.
At some point in the future we'd love to resurrect the idea though, and some of our other models might be up for it too. Personally I'm a Goth and tend to hang around mostly with like-minded people, so being in pubs with guys and girls in PVC, fetish gear, etc is completely normal, but at the same time unless there are trouble-makers (or chavs) about, being non-vanilla doesn't really attract as much attention as people might think.
Can't promise to attend at this stage as schedules tend to be rather demanding, but I'd definetly like to know about any non-vanilla meets that are planned, either in London or further north. We're based in Leeds.
At some point in the future we'd love to resurrect the idea though, and some of our other models might be up for it too. Personally I'm a Goth and tend to hang around mostly with like-minded people, so being in pubs with guys and girls in PVC, fetish gear, etc is completely normal, but at the same time unless there are trouble-makers (or chavs) about, being non-vanilla doesn't really attract as much attention as people might think.
Can't promise to attend at this stage as schedules tend to be rather demanding, but I'd definetly like to know about any non-vanilla meets that are planned, either in London or further north. We're based in Leeds.
- DungeonMasterOne
- http://www.gungemaster.com - Visit Saturation Hall, the UK's messiest stately home!
- by my hand and seal, as Lady Jasmine commands.
- http://www.gungemaster.com - Visit Saturation Hall, the UK's messiest stately home!
- by my hand and seal, as Lady Jasmine commands.
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by Jonny » 29 Nov 2006, 00:07
Both Newcastle and Warrington were Saturday afternoon gigs and were quite well attended... Ideally we should be moving away from the Crapital....The provincial meets have been fairly good - speaking as a person who dislikes London with a passion (no offence its just souless, and inaccessible by motor, unless you want to pay Ken!)
What happened to the meet at the Splosh Local?
What happened to the meet at the Splosh Local?
"Mousse from a bowl is very nice, but to pour it over someone is demented" Alan Partridge
http://www.gungemistress.com We got messy, all tied up.....
http://www.gungemistress.com We got messy, all tied up.....
by dirtydids » 29 Nov 2006, 00:21
Very good point Jonny, however this again raises a problem, London has very good rail links accross the country. I actually live in Nottinghamshire, but work in Essex 10 days then home for 6. I can only go to a meet if it coincides with me being down there or being able to rearrange my work. A lot of people who go to these London meets do either work in London or live in the Home Counties, dont forget not everyone can afford to travel long distances or book hotels overnight.
I have never done it but for me to drive to Warrington for instance would be about 2 hours maybe more i would imagine, public transport from here? dont even go there Saying that i think Wamadeus is fantastic how he manages it & credit must also go to Andy, Our long distance Wammers
I have never done it but for me to drive to Warrington for instance would be about 2 hours maybe more i would imagine, public transport from here? dont even go there
Saying that i think Wamadeus is fantastic how he manages it & credit must also go to Andy, Our long distance Wammers I love a messy girl
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