Do you drive a car in the UK??? Look here..... (off topic)

[muddywildfire]

Off topic i know but felt i had to post!!

If you drive a car, please read

Sarah Kennedy was talking about this proposed car tax scheme on Radio 2.
Apparently there is only one month left to register your objection
to the 'Pay As You Go' road tax.

The petition is on the 10 Downing St website but they didn't tell
anybody about it. Therefore at the time of Sarah's comments only 250,000 people hand signed it and 750,000 signatures are required for the government to at least take any notice.

Once you've given your details (you don't have to give your full
address, just house number and postcode will do), they will send you an email
with a link in it. Once you click on that link, you'll have signed the petition.

The government's proposal to introduce road pricing will mean you
having to purchase a tracking device for your car and paying a monthly bill to use it.

The tracking device will cost about £200 and in a recent study by the
BBC,the lowest monthly bill was £28 for a rural florist and £194 for a delivery driver. A non working mother who used the car to take the kids to school paid £86 in one month.

On top of this massive increase in tax, you will be tracked. Somebody will know where you are at all times. They will also know how fast you have been going, so even if you accidentally creep over a speed limit in time you can probably expect a Notice of Intended Prosecution with your monthly bill.

If you are concerned about this Orwellian plan and want to stop the
constant
bashing of the car driver, please sign the petition on No 10's new
website (link below) and pass this on to as many people as possible. Sign up if you value your freedom and democratic rights!!!!!

http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/traveltax

[Richard]

They are well over 900,000 now so I'm sure they will rethink the idea. Actually I am not against making those who use the roads most pay the most (sorry Hayley) but I think it would be better to tax petrol & diesel more heavily and scrap the current car tax.

Confession:- I only do about 1000 miles per year, it would be cheaper to use taxies all the time but I like the convenience of having the car handy.

[DungeonMasterOne]

This spam is everywhere, and the figures are garbage.

The single mum shouldn't be driving her kids to school, they should walk. Better for them, safer for both them and all the other kids (no manic parking at school gates). Much much healthier for them and her if she goes with them.

This so-called petition is the work of a rabid road-loby who care about nothing but driving wherever they like as fast as they like, and to hell with anyone who doesn't drive or just wants to live in a civilised country.

Fact is, we need to change our use of vehicles - and to a large extent reduce it. The proposed system will charge people less for driving on uncongested roads and more for driving into congested city centres, where it'd be better for everyone if they took trains, busses or trams instead.

Any wammer who like me has done mudplay in outdoor locations will have seen how all-pervasive petrochemical pollution of the UK's natural places is. There are some lovely deep rich spots on the Humber that are unusable due to a continuous film of oil on the surface - touch it and you get nasty rashes. Much of it comes from oily water washed off the roads by rain, the oil coming from car engines.

I'm no eco-warrior (we have Maiden up here at the Hall for for that! ), but the fact is we simply cannot go on as we have been doing. Not unless we're happy for the human race to exterminate itself entirely in the next 500 years.

[Richard]

I can't argue with any of that. Well said DungeonMasterOne!

*APPLAUDS*

Richard.

[Sidi]

Bloody tree hugging hippies

Kids shouldn't be at school after they reach their 12 birthday, they should be shoved in the workhouse or made to go up chimneys, teach them some respect for their elders.

You should be able to use your car to go where you want when you want, this government is trying to think up more way to recouperate the tax they are losing now through lost tobacco sales.

Its all this "pollution Tax". A central heating boiler last year cost £475 on average, now you have to fit an eco condensing one as its now the law and they cost around £700.
A recent study said that to make new cars comply with the tighter laws the government are to bring out will add around £2k to the cost of a car.

Saving the planet is all well and good in theory, but it isn't half getting expensive to do it, and I will be long dead before it starts to take full effect

[muddy_clothes]

Is this for real, IE did you actually see the programme on the radio this morning or just repost someone else's link? I tried googling it, but only could find more articles like yours, nothing saying it is true or false. Snopes also came up empty

[messylaura]

hmmm global warming v V8's

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvEc24Tdh2Y

[messyslime]

I don't drive but I don't believe in monitoring how other people drive and how much they use the road, etc. I certainly don't believe in more road taxes; a simple increase in income tax could fix a lot of problems.

But this petition is about as useful as one at Petition Online. Just because it's on the Number 10 website that doesn't mean it's going to get into someone's hands any faster.

Having said that, I signed it.

[BillShipton]

Posted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 11:40 am    Post subject:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
As far as I knw the proposal is not for MORE road tax but simply to replace the current road tax with one based on how far you travel. It is a scheme that has been tried out successfully in other countries. However the "infringing my personal freedom" lobby are out in force and organising some sort of campaign - backed, of all people, by the Daily Mirror.

Personally as a non-driver who lives on a main road, I'd ban the whole fucking lot. Cars should only be used for sport, and everyone should have to travel by public transport like me - then they might actually improve it. Also Hayley would have to stay at home and get sploshed rather than drive all over the country!

Sarah Kennedy is almost certainly a supporter of this anti-road pricing campaign. She is a mad, drunken, right winger who spouts the Daily Mail consistently. She once came for a drink in Hastings with me and a mate and was the classic drunk - loud one minute, funny, giggling, angry then in floods of tears. She has turned up pissed at 6am several times and been refused on air, and also spouted the sort of Mail racism that is far more dangerous than Jade throwing a moddy. She should be banned from the radio!

And Clarkson.

Yours tolerantly
Bill

PS I know the first paragraph isn't practical and some people HAVE to drive but something drastic does have to be done.

PPS As for the fear of being monitored...we are all monitored all the time! CCTV, loyalty cards, computers.... monitoring someting that is actually doing harm, which traffic is, seems relatively harmless.

[DungeonMasterOne]

Everyone should have to travel by public transport like me - then they might actually improve it.

There's certainly a strong argument that anyone electrd to public office should have to travel by public transport all the time. Imagine how much better the railways would be if Blair, et all, had to use them daily.

Also Hayley would have to stay at home and get sploshed rather than drive all over the country!

I'll vote for that!

PPS As for the fear of being monitored...we are all monitored all the time! CCTV, loyalty cards, computers.... monitoring someting that is actually doing harm, which traffic is, seems relatively harmless.

A good point. There is now 1 CCTV camera for every 14 people in the UK, and they're about to pass a law that will compel every CCTV operator to upgrade their system to a police specification, including the ability to incorporate recognition and tracking systems, and data capture for behaviour modeling / prediction software. Now that *is* scary.

On the other hand powered vehicles are used for, and facilitate, a huge amount of crime. Tracking them effectively (and spotting illegal cars the instant they drive anywhere) can only be a good thing, IMO. Then we can all spend less time worrying about having our cars and vans stolen.

[andy250]

I have to say, I miss driving, it pisses me right off, having raced here their and everywhere, I think we should leave the current situation alone, you cannot get out of taxing your car due to the electronic system that is now in force. The same goes for mots.

regards

Andy
(need to get in a rally car one more time, get dm in the passenger seat!!!!)

[messyalan]

I do not understand how they hope to administer a satellite based systems without spending a fortune on staffing, euipment and enforcement. As usual the people who are honest will pay and the dishonest will find a way round it within a week. We have a foolproof method of taxing people for the miles they travel and the pollution they cause. Increase the tax on petrol and remove road tax. To reduce the impact on delivery prices the haulage companies would need some tax concessions or, better still, put freight back on the railways where it belongs. This is something that many lobby groups have been campaigning for over the past few years. It is almost foolproof, cheap to implement but is a sure fire way to lose the next election.

[DungeonMasterOne]

Increasing fuel tax would destroy a lot of already fragile rural ecconomies. The problem with it is it doesn't take account of congestion, which has already become a major problem. The average speed of traffic in London now is slower than it was in the age of the horse, and most other major cities are the same.

Most of the enforcement can be automatic. Put trenaponder-recognisers at all major junctions (start with the motorways and work out in a rolling programme), where there are already automatic number plate recognition systems. Any car which doesn't respond is flagged by the system and tracked by the plate-recognisers. If it's a one-off failure nothing is done, if it's persistent then the keeper gets a letter, if not fixed within a set time, they get fined. All automated, no huge staffing needed.

[messyalan]

I appeciate your arguement but I still say it is a huge expense for such a system. I live in a rural community and as soon as a police checkpoint was set up for HGV inspections on the main road the majority of lorries used our village as a bypass. The authorities responded with a weight limit which had no effect at all. If I have to pay more for travelling on the congested main road I would soon find the back route through the villages to save money!
City congestion is a problem but this has been addressed in London without satellite technology. Putting better public transport in place BEFORE introducing congestion charging would move a large number of people off the roads and maybe even do away with the need for congestion charges at all.
Where I live I have to drive at least part of the way into town as there is no suitable public transport. Given the cost of parking etc. I would gladly use the bus, train or tram if available.

[muddywildfire]

I agree with people paying for what they use but I do not agree with big brother type enforcement. All these ideas are just money spinners for the government. How does the creation of millions of pounds help the planet.!?? Public transport should be better in all major cities and ethanol should be introduced. Where are the bio-diesel cars sold??, Hydrogen cars anyone. Black gold rules the world we live in. this is what should be changed!!